Sunday, July 15, 2007

Pay Our Government Employees More?

Once again we're hearing about how poorly our local government employees are being paid. The Eureka Reporter gives us a comparison between our local governments and other municipalities.

Sure, local government workers may not get paid as well as those in some other places. I still say they make decent money. I'd almost be willing to kill to make the money some of them are making.

We don't want to get into a bidding war with other cities and counties for employees. That will only break us. Money is the motivating factor for a lot of job choices, but not the only one. The Eureka Reporter, in a story on the Eureka Police Department, quotes my old national guard buddy, Sgt. Bill Nova:
“Pay’s nice to have — it’s great — but that’s not what motivates 99 percent of cops.”

He should know. I believe he has around 20 years or more with the department, as do some others. Others will always be chasing the money. I don't think we should be bending over backwards trying to keep them.

62 Comments:

At 11:21 AM, Anonymous Anonymous said...

Apparently lots of others like you Fred don't think anyone should be bending over backward to keep them. Her-Dildo and his ilk keep trying to bend them over forward and get rid of them.

 
At 12:09 PM, Blogger Anon.R.mous said...

I couldn't see why Heraldo doesn't want police around. Maybe he wants to go on a killing spree or something?

 
At 12:36 PM, Anonymous Anonymous said...

Fred, if you want decent pay, you have to work for it. School, moving around, reading boring books... Do you understand this concept? Maybe you should list some of the differences between Sgt. Nova and yourself. My guess is the difference here would be your total lack of discipline and your IQ which seems to hover around 75. Some people are just meant to be lawnmower men. Others are meant to be heroes. At your age Fred, you will never amount to anything.

 
At 1:13 PM, Anonymous Anonymous said...

We already ARE in a bidding war; and you get what you pay for.

 
At 1:19 PM, Anonymous Anonymous said...

Most cops do it for the sense of power and control.

I had a freind who was very kind and respectful to people but after going to the police academy he turned into a complete asshole. He'd pick fights with people then pull out his badge...complete asshole. I asked hime why he was treating people like shit and he said in so many words "I'm a better man than they are".

I turned around and walked away...never looked back.

 
At 1:38 PM, Anonymous Anonymous said...

1:19 pm you sound like an asshole yourself.

Fred you deserve getting beat up on this one. Just in the past two years look at what HC has lost? Rick Bennet the fire chief went to Clovis. Trained by EFD, got his experience at the expense of Eureka and now Clovis has his experience and training at almost no cost to them. What about Capt Cerabellini from the Sheriff Office Jail ? Just last month she left to go to Sacramento, got her training and experience here and now gone. How many cops and deputies have left I don't know. Not only do you lose experienced people that know the community but someone has to recruit, backround, and train the replacements! It costs lots of money

You get what you pay for. Some will stay because of family but others will get their training and experience and then go somewhere where they'll get paid for it.

Just because the the cops get make more than you doesn't mean they're overpaid. Look at what the cops put up with! They are exposed to a lot of ugly things; bums, child abuse, child molesters, dirty & diseased people, verbal and physical assaults, shift work, Ken Miller, Hairaldo, and a DA that looks forward to any chance at prosecuting them.

The county pays out more than a quarter million to the risk manager for ???????????? Now she takes a BIG bonus and still heads off for a good paying job.

You reap what you sow.

 
At 1:38 PM, Anonymous Anonymous said...

Its funny what happens to people when you give them a gun and badge. For some, you can see power and authority go straight to their heads, right away. Those kind of people scare the shit out of me.

 
At 1:39 PM, Anonymous Anonymous said...

Another place to investigate and compare salaries is at local state agencies like HSU. They are supposed to adhere to statewide standards in terms of salaries and job classifications. The fact that the jobs are in Humboldt County shouldn't cause reduced salaries because the funding source comes from outside the county. Keep dreamin'.

 
At 1:51 PM, Blogger Anon.R.mous said...

If you look at the pay scale for College of the Redwoods you will find that it is also completely out of wack to other CC in California.

 
At 2:49 PM, Anonymous Anonymous said...

Fred is on public assistance.

 
At 2:51 PM, Blogger Fred said...

1:38 wrote, "Just because the the cops get make more than you doesn't mean they're overpaid. Look at what the cops put up with!".

And isn't it interesting what past Eureka Police Chief, Ray Shipley, told my CR Police Academy back in '84: Some people even do this job for free....

He was speaking of reserve officers, of course.

 
At 3:14 PM, Blogger Stephen said...

Does anyone see a pattern here? More crime, more cops, more prisons, more money.

Perhaps the pay differential between big city salaries and Humboldt should be put towards educating our youth not to become criminals, e.g. how come NO ONE in Humboldt County officialdom is addressing the fact that there's a whole generation of young adults who have learned the foolish lesson that major grows and meth labs are worth the risks. No one is really teaching them otherwise and they end up costing us salaried cop and court costs over and above what we can afford as a community.

 
At 3:22 PM, Anonymous Anonymous said...

we live in a corrupt county where city and county officials are able to pocket money for bribes, they dont need any more money......this happens in law enforcement as well as in the administrative offices of our corrupt county and city offices........members of the good-ole boy network woudn't be in these positions if they didn't pay well

 
At 3:36 PM, Anonymous Anonymous said...

Man, 3:22, I'm working this job and not getting any of the good-ole boy cash. I'm totally being screwed! Please have your people call my people so I can cash in on the gravy train.

 
At 3:52 PM, Anonymous nick bravo said...

I got beaten up by Arcata cops once just for having fun in the alley behind teh bars. Those pigs come anywhere near me again and I will pepper spray them.

 
At 6:03 PM, Anonymous Anonymous said...

Eureka's where all the hardcore homeless live. Nick wouldn't last a second. Remember, it's a choice with him.

 
At 6:57 PM, Anonymous Anonymous said...

This comment has been removed by a blog administrator.

 
At 10:47 PM, Anonymous Anonymous said...

This comment has been removed by a blog administrator.

 
At 6:52 AM, Blogger Carol said...

It looks like your blog has been spammed by the same person that spammed Samoa Softball, Fred.

I am in favor of better wages for police, as well as contiuning education in law enforcement.

 
At 7:11 AM, Blogger Fred said...

But, Carol, you're in favor of better wages for all government employees.

Yes, the spammeister has struck again and been deleted.

 
At 7:18 AM, Anonymous Anonymous said...

Well, then there are multiple "spammeisters" then, and my post was on-topic. Nick became the topic the minute Fred allowed Nick's self-serving youtube link to remain (2:52 p.m.). If you don't want discussion about Nick (even tame, safe chatter like I posted), then I suggest to Fred that he take a look at the off-topic stuff he allows to remain that simply attracts follow-up comments. Fred, you're inviting the comments you supposedly don't like.

 
At 7:49 AM, Anonymous Anonymous said...

The problem with using comparator cities is that it becomes a never ending cycle of wages and benefits being raised; as soon as Eureka gets their increase, another city will be lowest on the list and will agitate for an increase; and the cycle endlessly repeats itself.

As far as the officer who took a 22 percent pay "cut" after moving from a dealership, saying that he didnt do it for the money; I'd wager that he did it for (in addition to wanting to be a police officer) a couple of things

- 1. The benefits are FAR better than those in the private sector, especially EPD's PERS benefits as well as the enhanced medical benefits that Eureka's Police and Fire Safety employees have. If you compared total salary AND benefits to this officer's former job, chances are that he is making more than he did at the car dealership.

-2 Job security. It seems evident that there is better job security working in the public sector than the private sector.

 
At 8:06 AM, Blogger Fred said...

"The problem with using comparator cities is that it becomes a never ending cycle of wages and benefits being raised; as soon as Eureka gets their increase, another city will be lowest on the list and will agitate for an increase; and the cycle endlessly repeats itself.".

Exactly, although I suppose to some extent that's inevitable over time anyway. Still, no reason to bend over backwards to make it happen even faster.

 
At 10:07 AM, Anonymous Anonymous said...

So you just ignore it?

 
At 10:23 AM, Anonymous Anonymous said...

Bottom line is you need to pay your public safety personnel better. If not they will get the training, the experience, the govt. certificates, and then go somewhere that pays better. It only makes sense. What is the cost of recruiting and training a brand new cop? How many years of service is the break even point? Think of it as a business or an investment.

I read the articles and I tend to think that the only reason more EPD cops haven't left is because half of them are newbies and still on probation. Wait til they get a couple years under their belt.

You can't compare a cop to used car salesman. Totally different jobs and required qualifications.

Look at the article in todays paper! Chief Kitna and Officer Chapman are the only FPD cops left from 1991! Where did they all go? A couple to retirements maybe. I'm sure it's about the same with the sheriffs office.

I'm sure other state law enforcement agencies appreciate Humboldt County paying to train their coppers.

 
At 10:34 AM, Anonymous Anonymous said...

Fred can't put up any argument other than the 'slippery slope'. So Fred, wheres your EVIDENCE to back up your position? Very sad old man.

 
At 11:43 AM, Anonymous Anonymous said...

10:23,

I support our safety employees, but when you add up their wage and benefit packages, they do quite well. If they want to relocate, then so be it.

My point is that wages are below industry standards on the northcoast are lower than most everywhere else; FOR just about every profession/trade. I am not going to shed a tear for someone making 80k per year (and when you add salaries AND benefits, thats a conservative estimate).

I could make much more elsewhere, but I choose to make my home in Humboldt County.

 
At 12:05 PM, Anonymous mresquan said...

It's all about the CalPers benefits.it's why Lyndsey McWilliams left and many others.A $65k a year salary here for county employees jumps at 25% once you leave.Do it within a few years of planning to retire and you retire with the compensation you've made from your nice salary increase.We can continue with this wage war all we want,doesn't matter,people leave for the those union benies whenever and wherever they can.

 
At 12:25 PM, Blogger Fred said...

Yep. I was talking to a deputy sheriff last week who used to be with Eureka P.D. He said he was likely moving down to the desert (Hemet area) and would be doing a lateral transfer where he'd do basically the same job for better money. He works in the courthouse now.

He said the raise in pay toward the end of his career would greatly improve his retirement package and give him full health coverage for life, among other things.

I asked him why he would possibly want to move to the desert and he actually said he loved the heat. Whatever.

Those of you that have been following the issue should know public employee pensions, especially health benefits, are becoming a serious liability to local and state governments. This can't keep going on the way it is.

Thing is, few dare question retirement benefits of public safety personnel as they're afraid of being seen as anti- cop.

 
At 2:17 PM, Anonymous Anonymous said...

Gee Fred, are you advocating national health insurance?

 
At 2:27 PM, Anonymous Anonymous said...

Sorry Fred, I fail to see where youre coming from. So we should eliminate health coverage? That will solve the staffing issue? As far as your Deputy Sheriff friend, it sounds like he has earned the right to seek higher pay. Isnt that a Libertarian thing, maximizing your own profitability? That seems like an American thing. You just sound like someone who is desperately bitter. Well, I'll tell you what Fred, go apply for a job at Safeway and you will have similar health benefits within 3-4 months. There are solutions to your dilemma, but they require action on your part.

 
At 4:31 PM, Blogger Carol said...

Fred said...
"But, Carol, you're in favor of better wages for all government employees."

Not necessarily for all government employees, Fred. Cost of living raises to adjust to the economy to be addressed. Many of us do earn less than we could in other areas in the state. But the cost of living is much higher in other areas, although we are catching-up. It is well known that many of the local smaller police jurisdictions are training grounds for new police grads. We have a relative in law enforcement in another area who would love to move back to Eureka, but the wages and benefits can not compare to their present situation.
If someone is well-trained and professional, then they should be compensated.

 
At 6:16 PM, Blogger Stephen said...

Carol, do you really think it is fair that a 45 year old person who works 40 hrs per week scrubbing toilets, cleaning other people's dirty houses, cleaning sick people's bodies, is adequately compensated at the in-home care service rate compensation?

Does the farm worker who busts his butt in the hot sun day after day adequately compensated as the MBA in in his air-conditioned office?

I am sorry but I truly am a communitarian at heart and our market-based wage compensation system is so totally out of whack with the actual calories put out by working people that to defend it as a "Progressive" is ludicrous. This just marks your mainstream Democrat protecting job pay scales in order to sell the Party's current platform. In other words, there's no long range planning, only status quo solutions that do not address the fundamental issues of unequal pay for equal amounts of work expended. In the functioning of society, the housewife, the in-home care-giver, is as vital as doctors and dentists.

 
At 6:25 PM, Anonymous Anonymous said...

Figures dn't lie but liars can sure figure. Eureka is last in pay because its also last in desirability. I don't believe most of the folks who say they could "make more elsewhere". If they actually could, it would mean taking a job with more responsibility, headaches and challenges. In short, they would have to WORK alot harder for that extra pay. What they're REALLY choosing isn't to forgo more pay but to forgo more WORK. That's consistent with the reason most people stay here if they're locals, or move here from out of the area. In short, they aren't ambitious(and proud of it). They don't want(or aren't capable) to compete head to head with a larger number of ambitious people. Fred's a typical example.

I think the numbers from the Reporter article bear out my opinion. Compare Eureka to Atascadero(where there's a large State Mental Hospital). Eureka is much poorer even though it's percapita income and education is about the same. The difference is that Atascadero's citizens are more industrious and motivated. They have much higher household income since they comprise intact families who cooperate rather than doin' drugs, gettin' drunk and fightin', which are the red neck hobbies of choice for many Eurekans.

 
At 7:22 PM, Anonymous Anonymous said...

Yes Stephen, surprise surprise, this society values education and knowledge. Anybody can scrub toilettes. But not everyone can work in a knowledge industry. This may come as a surprise to you, but not every toilette scrubber is made out to run a library system or law enforcement agency, or develop software in the private sector. Youre an idiot if you think so.

But then again, we can blame the Jews for this current system, can't we Stephen??

 
At 7:45 PM, Anonymous Anonymous said...

This comment has been removed by a blog administrator.

 
At 9:00 PM, Blogger Stephen said...

I see Fred has the same anon cowards as Eric's blog-the anons that like to hide behind their computer bushes and throw mud pies at their betters 'cause they is so damn jealous of people with guts to stand behind their opinions.

And talk about dumb? Anon here thinks that edoocation entitles a person to thumb their noses at the manual laborers. What an idiot! I hope the next time he buys groceries he finds a worm in his tomatoes that some uppity migrant worker stuck there just for people like him.

I've been to college, U.C. Berkeley, and I've done in-home care. I've been a consultant to C.E.O.s and I've washed dishes in restaurants. Don't begin to tell me that education level makes any difference at the end of the work day in a person's value to society. The housewife unpaid is more valuable than the insurance exec getting a mil or two/year.

 
At 9:52 PM, Anonymous Anonymous said...

I make about 25% of what I did in the Bay Area. My wife makes roughly 1/3. We live in Eureka and will never leave. You can not possibly earn enough anywhere else to pay for what we have here. I am sad so many are blind to what they have.

 
At 10:02 PM, Anonymous Anonymous said...

Stephen, you forgot to add the part where you blame all the Jews, and how American Jewry has perverted the system. Go on! It was just on the tip of your tounge!

 
At 10:19 PM, Anonymous Anonymous said...

This comment has been removed by a blog administrator.

 
At 5:10 AM, Blogger Stephen said...

Poor Zionist racist anon 10: minus 2 and 19..poor baby, widdo Stephen has got you tweaked, eh?

Gotta sling a slammer at him but that one? That "Anti-Semite" slur you used? Well, go sell that one to your Zionist Neo-Con buddies in the White House and Israel because it doesn't fly around here with so many REAL Semitic friends instead of you PHONY Ashkenazi ones. Europeans posing as "Semitic Jews", what a joke, but what a hideous one .

Fred bloggers, go to my Steve Lewis blog site to see for yourselves how twisted and sick the Zionist ideology is--that it motivates Israelis to pass their racist hatred directly onto their children.

And see for yourselves how Israelis treat Palestinians who do engage in non-violent resistance. No wonder most Pals see Israelis as modern Nazis..Zionism in action is fascist.

 
At 5:16 AM, Blogger Stephen said...

Fred, your link to my blog didn't work for me.

To reach my Steve Lewis blog where the truth about Zionist racism in Israel and the OPT can be seen directly at: http://steve-lewis.blogspot.com/

 
At 5:37 AM, Blogger Pogo said...

Stephen, the next time you need surgery, dental care, legal defense, a fireman, policeman or architect call a toilet cleaning technician or a tomato picker. We suspected that much of UC Berkley was in trouble but had no idea it was as bad as you indicate.

 
At 6:48 AM, Anonymous Anonymous said...

"In a higher phase of communist society... only then can the narrow horizon of bourgeois right be fully left behind and society inscribe on its banners: from each according to his ability, to each according to his needs."
Karl Marx

 
At 8:24 AM, Anonymous Anonymous said...

To Stephen; In home health care is important and not very glamorous or well paid. I'm sure people do it for different reasons. Having a clean toilet is nice but doesn't take much training or skill......... certain jobs require education, training, and personal traits. The CEO in the air conditioned office went to college, maybe has a masters degree, and more than likely worked his/her way up to that spot. It's true some have more opportunity to go to college than others, that's life. As for the police and fire people, they have to work shifts, nights, and holidays which many are not willing to do. Police have to undergo a thorough background investigation that many, good people included, could not pass. Some people have to take the less than glamourous or well paid jobs because of something they've done, an example is stealing. Do you really think that a person that went to prison or jail for stealing (burglary, embezzlement, identity theft and so on) is going to have the same employment oppourtunities. Or do you think a meth user should be a policeman?

To maintain and improve the quality of life in Humboldt County (and anywhere) efforts should be taken to hire and keep/maintain experienced police, fire, and other government employees.

just a thought or two. nothing will change the minds of those who are unhappy because a policeman makes more than they do and still wants more. The only thing I can say to that is "loser".

 
At 8:34 AM, Anonymous Anonymous said...

8:24, I had the opposite reaction. I was shocked to learn I earn a little more than police officers. What I do isn't nearly as important or as demanding.

 
At 8:54 AM, Anonymous Anonymous said...

Hey I am in favor of the county withholding Gallegos' paychecks if and until he makes a decision on Cheri Moore -

He ain't doing his job so why should this county pay him 140K per year?

 
At 10:28 AM, Anonymous Anonymous said...

Stephen you are a bigot.

 
At 2:28 PM, Blogger Stephen said...

I am so very sorry to tell all of you prejudiced people that when you get old and infirm and the doctor and hospital bills have taken all your savings, you will learn to appreciate those in-home care-givers who will end up saving your life.

Yes, I said saving your life. People do not have any idea of what happens to bodies that cannot bath themselves or even turn over in bed. Bed sores can and will kill you if they aren't treated and that treatment is done by in-home care workers.

Doctors and nurses don't do this service except for the very rich. If it were not for those low paid in-home healthcare workers older infirm people would be dying far more often than otherwise.

Again, I am sorry for people who are prejudiced against those who haven't gone to college for whatever reasons. Our society is kept together by paper pushers? By salesmen? By men who go to play golf and make million dollar deals?

No, it's the farm worker who's putting that food on your plate who's really supporting you. And the Indian seamstress making 5 cents an hour putting the shirt on your back. Without the actual workers who do the actual physical work, society does not function and to ignore this reality only maintains the illusion that all is well.

 
At 2:34 PM, Blogger Stephen said...

Anon 10:28, I guess you aren't to swift upstairs and don't get it that every time you anon cowards post your hate Steves, it provides me with another opportunity to tell people how racist Zionism is and how ugly the Zionist nation's racist policies and hatred of Arabs is to look that we support with our U.S. tax dollars.

http://steve-lewis.blogspot.com/

 
At 8:34 PM, Anonymous Anonymous said...

You just proved 1028am right Stevie.

 
At 3:54 AM, Blogger Stephen said...

Can't be a bigot when you're a critic of bigots, and that's what Zionists are, bigots, racial bigots.

Israelis think of Arab Palestinians as less than human with less than human rights. Palestinian children mean nothing and can be blown to little pieces by cluster bombs with Israeli children taught to put sign their death warrants on the bombs as all can see on my blog site.

 
At 12:41 PM, Anonymous Anonymous said...

give it up loser !

 
At 12:53 PM, Anonymous Anonymous said...

Hey Stephen, why dont you make a verbal contract with the forest animals. See, that way you could raise an army of impressive size out of the natural environment around you. You could use this forest army to invade Israel and free the Palestinian children! You are a natural choice to lead the forest corp to victory!

 
At 8:05 PM, Anonymous Anonymous said...

"Marsupials, move into grid 3 and ATTACK!"

 
At 9:00 PM, Anonymous Anonymous said...

Some authorities teach that America's historical treatment of the Indians was based on Israel's historical treatment of the Canaanites (the people who lived in Palestine before the Jews arrived). Key concept: The Chosen People are given the right, nay the duty, by God to kill all the people living in the Promised Land prior to the arrival of the Chosen People. Etc. Etc.

If Old Testament believers had succeeded, there would be no Native Americans alive today. Adherents of the New Testament gained strength in time to stop the killing before the genocide on the North American continent became complete.

 
At 4:58 AM, Blogger Stephen said...

Ah, there's some truth posted. The concept of "Manifest Destiny" has the same racist ideology as "Chosen Ones" and "Master Race".

Every time a Zionist posts supporting the genocide of Palestinian society, which one can see in action as the (Berlin-Chinese) Wall divides the landscape up forcing Palestinians ever more into bantustans where they can't get to work or schools or hospitals without going numerous through security checks--the same result was obtained in South Africa by Afrikaaners with the use of passes limiting movement of blacks anywhere in their own country.

 
At 5:00 AM, Blogger Stephen said...

The face of fascism is always the same. The men in uniforms with guns shoving the native population to the ground..

 
At 7:22 AM, Anonymous Anonymous said...

Dear Mr. 9:00PM

Therapy or medication may provide you with some relief. And .....

It appears as if the famous blog bigot SL has another drug to bang.

 
At 10:55 AM, Blogger Stephen said...

Oh gee golly, did anon 9:00 hit a raw nerve? Truth does hurt sometimes..

 
At 6:01 PM, Anonymous Anonymous said...

Yes Stevie it does! It certainly does.

 
At 9:38 AM, Anonymous Anonymous said...

If any wants real DATA in local wages vs elsewhere, go to the EDD's website where you can check out the CALJOBS listings for all counties. For that matter, look at all the out-of-area jobs that have appeared in the T-S lately. A $2 an hour differential , compounded over time by percentage increases is a strong motivator for people trying to raise families.

 

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