Saturday, September 15, 2007

Too Much Garbage In Southern Humboldt

Looks like the garbage transfer center for Southern Humboldt is getting overwhelmed. Too much garbage being generated for its capacity so they're looking into upgrading the transfer station.

I'd be curious- SoHum being as politically correct as it is- to take a look at what's being dumped and how much is recyclable.

59 Comments:

At 8:55 AM, Anonymous Anonymous said...

Fred, what is your definition of politically correct?

 
At 9:01 AM, Blogger The Boy Most Likely to ... said...

If you are talking about upgrading the Transfer Station, to include recovery of materials that can be recycled, than you are talking about a major cost to initiate. Sorting the garbage will need to be done by hand, and even if material is recovered, will the cost of transporting to the manufacturing plants make this upgrade worth it. I would not be surprised of the Transfer Station increases its size to accommodate more garbage, and some additional public recycling.

-boy

 
At 9:11 AM, Blogger Fred said...

"politically correct?".

Good question. Lot of environmentalists in Sohum, aren't there? That's politically correct.

Boy wrote, "If you are talking about upgrading the Transfer Station,...".

I believe Redway already has a place to drop off recycling stuff. I'm not sure but I don't think they're talking about upgrading to the point where they separate recyclables down there.

I think they just want a dump that can accomodate more trash at a given time. They'll still be hauling it to Fortuna, I would think.

 
At 10:05 AM, Blogger The Boy Most Likely to ... said...

Fred, the very last statement you make in your post implies that somebody(s) should sort through the garbage to remove the stuff that can be recycled. Larger waste management companies do this. People pick out what can be recycled into new products. I am saying that an upgrade to that kind of system requires a lot of investment, and I am unsure if a small company like Eel River Disposal would take that project.

-boy

 
At 10:30 AM, Blogger Fred said...

I didn't mean to give that impression. I'm just curious how much the politically correct folks in Sohum recycle.

I'm a somewhat fanatical recycler myself, despite knowing sometimes it's simply not cost effective to recycle some things. Sometimes the recycling "cure" can be worse than the disease.

For instance; I was told by the guy that runs General Recycling in Eureka that arsenic and cyanide are byproducts of polystyrene(?) recycling- one of those plastics, anyway.

Might it be better to just dump those in the landfill? But I digress.

I've just been of the opinion that recycling is politically correct nowadays, especially among younger folk. I've been really surprised when using the dumpsters, at apartments I work at, how many recyclables(newspapers, tin cans, etc.) are actually being thrown away. And younger people tend to be the predominant tenants in those apartments.

I'm wondering if SoHum hippies are doing much recycling? I guess there's no way to tell who's dumping what just by looking at the garbage bins in Redway, though.

 
At 10:31 AM, Blogger Fred said...

Correction: I think it was sulphuric acid and cyanide (or arsenic) that were the byproducts from some type of plastic recycling.

 
At 1:37 PM, Anonymous Anonymous said...

Fred you don't seem to know much about anything, so why open you mouth?

 
At 2:25 PM, Blogger The Boy Most Likely to ... said...

Fred, I see your point. I mean, how diligent are we as recyclers?? I try, but I know that there are things I can do to better reduce my waste.

-boy

 
At 2:58 PM, Blogger Fred said...

Seriously. I've been surprised looking in apartment dumpsters and seeing empty tin cans in tenant's kitchen garbage. You know it's kitchen garbage because they're 13 gallon garbage bags with other food stuff in them.

I always rinse my used cans out and take them in to the recycling center and assumed most- not everybody, but most- others did the same, especially younger folk.

Apparently not.

 
At 3:51 PM, Anonymous Anonymous said...

Fred, youre a good boy, but it is creepy that you are looking at other peoples garbage. What are you sniffing around for?

 
At 4:35 PM, Anonymous Anonymous said...

Fred, you didn't answer my question. You said environmentalists are politically correct.

OK, fine. But what is your definition of politically correct?

Those two words are a derogatory term used most often by people who disagree with a viewpoint, but lack the words or thoughts to mount a cogent argument.

Fewer insults, more thought, please.

 
At 4:40 PM, Blogger Eric V. Kirk said...

Fred - it's been a hot topic for a decade now, since Eel River Disposal took over. They're supposedly mandated to take tin cans, but they don't. They're supposed to take all seven types of plastic, but they have three bins.

 
At 5:35 PM, Blogger Fred said...

4:35 asks: "Fred, you didn't answer my question. You said environmentalists are politically correct.".

I didn't? I thought I did. What do you think is non- pc amongst either environmentalists, or the mainstream?

I don't consider it an insult. Then again, maybe I do.

Why do you think environmentalists deserve to not be labeled "politically correct"?

 
At 7:27 PM, Anonymous Anonymous said...

If you Country Cousins will just hold to the Old Ways, all your solid waste troubles will soon be behind you.

Go back to the practice of rural Humboldters from years gone by. Be poor in physical wealth but rich in spiritual wealth. The latter never wears out or has to be thrown away.

 
At 10:41 PM, Blogger Rose said...

You're right, Fred. the "hippie" generation (mine and yours, I think) brought us the 'back to the land' movement. It was all about recycling, rejecting material things, building things from scratch, by hand and out of materials at hand. there was a tremendous sense of pride in that, and some phenomenal artistry that came with it. "Native Funk and Flash" - embroidery, hand carvings, beadwork - and above all, recycling.

Somewhere along the line, things went terribly wrong, and the generation that didn't want anyone else telling it what to do became the generation that wants to tell everyone what to do - what to eat, what to think, what color to paint your house... the generation that experimented with everything became the zero tolerance generation - and with that came the term "politically correct."

SoHum had one of the strongest 'back to the land' movements, communes, lots of out of the ordinary houses (read not-to-code), and that reputation still holds - so you would expect that they would be tops in the recycling in Humboldt County.

It's also part of why I don't get the whole Al Gore-Global-Warming-is-your-fault thing. We were all there. We believed in those concepts and we made them (recycling and caring about the environment) part of our lives. We didn't need anyone berating and blaming, we did it because we knew it was right. That's why you still recycle, I'm betting...

Long response - short response is, you're right. And maybe that answers your critic's question.

 
At 11:23 PM, Anonymous Anonymous said...

I remember seeing a lot of those SoHum hobbit houses. Very imaginative use of recycled building material. If anyone took high-quality photos of those unique little structures back in the day (maybe mid-1970's), they could turn them into one hell of an interesting coffee table book.

 
At 12:01 PM, Anonymous Anonymous said...

FredRose. When you're told that the country is going to war, you're OK. But when someone tells you not to eat meat, you're not OK. When your told taxes for wealthy people are being reduced because they know better how to spend money, you're OK. When someone tells you that using gasoline causes environmental destruction, you're not OK. In short, when its a Republican telling you what to do, you're OK. When its another party, you're not OK.

Its NOT about being told what to do its about what YOU believe people should do. Labeling people as "politically correct" or "hippie" is your way to demean and discredit them with generalized accusations and without any discussion of the facts and alternatives. Its a cheap rhetorical trick and others here have called you on it.

The reality is you have an partisan ax to grind. But you do it so comically and sloppily that you convince no one but preach to your tiny choir. Of course that's what you're really all about, being smug in a little group of the prejudiced, bigoted, and ignorant.

 
At 12:57 PM, Blogger Fred said...

Very wrong, 12:01.

 
At 1:19 PM, Blogger Bill said...

Fred, Just sayin' its so doesn't make it so. Your writing speaks for itself, whether or not you acknowledge it.

 
At 5:18 PM, Anonymous Anonymous said...

Well, I can't say whether that's true or not. It might be true. Some people have told me they think it's true. But other people disagree. So I'm not ready to come down on one side of this issue or the other. Signed, Fred.

Does that about capture it?

 
At 5:24 PM, Anonymous Anonymous said...

I’m part of the same baby boomer generation as you Rose and Fred, and I have nothing but contempt for what “our” generation is leaving to the next. I’m not a hippy, but I don’t sneer at the term “politically correct”. If we can get some of the hate speech out of our language it makes nothing but sense to me. You both relish your right wing bs and I can’t believe you cant see where this type of thinking has taken us. If I were part of the next generation I would hold us fat, lazy bastards accountable for all the idiotic decisions that we have made and put our grandchildren and their children in debt for, while not giving them any of the perks we take for granted. I got a great idea. How about each generation checks out by giving the next one a clean slate. No debt whatsoever. Pay it off as you check out. That means you can do it by estate taxes, income taxes, whatever taxes you want, but it all has to be paid up or you end up with what we’re giving our kids and grand kids. So if you don’t like taxes, don’t go into a war for idiotic reasons, don’t pass bonds for infrastructure renewal. Live with the decay and no safety net. If you think you want to see everybody in the world emulate our “democracy” then you pay for it, not your children!!!!

 
At 6:12 PM, Blogger Rose said...

I guess you don't "get" that I do not think of "hippie" as a derogative term.

But then, I can see, there is alot you don't get. Your glass is half empty.

And, 12:01, I believe it was a Democratic Governor who refused to deal with MTBE immediately and appropriately, in the face of incredible evidence of it's effects. And that wasn't a case of needing to figure out a way to get rid of it, it was only that they needed to STOP ADDING it. Much more to that little story - too much to go into here, but you keep jumping to conclusions, and as Fred says, you're very wrong.

 
At 6:12 PM, Anonymous An Enviro said...

Thanks for complimenting us by calling us "correct". Or does that mean "wrong" in reactionese?

 
At 6:20 PM, Blogger Rose said...

And by the way, 5:24. we are leaving our kids with a far better world than our grandparents had - remember they faced the depression, they faced war, far more destructive than anything we face today, orphanges were common, beating your wife was ok, heck, beating your kids was ok, smoking was glamorous, drinking was expected and drinking and driving was not a crime, food was sometimes scarce...

We, and our kids have all the food they can imagine even if it is out of season, so many items in a grocery store that you can't count them all, so many makes and models of cars to choose from that previous generations could not even imagine, not to mention cellphones, ipods, nintendo, wii, more power in the hands of eight year olds than mankind had when they sent a man to the moon, antibiotics - you know in my grandmother's time, many many babies and toddlers died from pneumonia, whooping cough, there was polio...

That's what I mean when I say your glass is half empty.

For all our faults, we are still a great people, a great nation, and it is a shame that you are unable to appreciate it.

 
At 6:41 PM, Blogger ΛΕΟΝΙΔΑΣ said...

Of course 12:01PM/5:24PM would not be expected to "sneer at the term politically correct” for the simple reason that the term "political correctness" is derived from Marxist-Leninist vocabulary, and is/was used to describe the appropriate leftist "party line", commonly referred to as the "correct line". 12:01PM/5:24PM is correct in observing that for the most part the successors to the "boomer" generation have departed from the marxist/leninist orthodoxy whose few remaining bastions of power include the social "science" departments of academia and the extreme left wing of the Democratic Party. Like 12:01PM/5:24PM other leftist protagonists must resort to the straw man gambit of placing words in the mouths of their opponents as the only means of debate. Fortunately, their BS fools no one except their own brethren.

 
At 6:41 PM, Blogger Bill said...

Rose, what a bunch of jingoistic crap you spew. You're implying 5:24 is unpatriotic and that's just plain mean, unfair and nasty. A cheap smear attack that you resort to when you avoid the facts. Its a Joe McCarthy tactic that has been repudiated along with wifebeating.

By the way, plenty of spousal abuse goes on, the divorce rate has skyrocketed in our great nation. The suicide rate among teens and substance dependency(both legal and illegal) has also gone way up. Isolated people hiding in gated communities, failing public schools, burgeoning public and private security forces, massive increases in prison populations and mass murderers ala Virginia tech and Columbine and going postal are now what our great people live among.

So its not about patriotism its about the facts. And few doubt that the physical and social world of America has degraded greatly in the last thirty years, even while toys and comforts abound. The glass IS half full, but the water in it is muddied and unsafe to drink.

 
At 6:49 PM, Anonymous big al said...

This was a post on "garbage"? Not off topic though when you read 5:24PM.

 
At 6:56 PM, Blogger Fred said...

I just wrote a somewhat lengthy response to Bill. I blew it and somehow deleted it.

To make this short: Bill is an Authoritarian. I beg him to show me one example where I've taken the side of the Right, where Liberty wasn't an issue.

I believe I've taken both the Left and Right to task.

Quite frankly, I think Bill is full of shit and is the last person anyone would want making their decisions for them.

 
At 7:02 PM, Anonymous Anonymous said...

bill seems to prefer kool aid to water

 
At 7:31 PM, Blogger Rose said...

I said she was unpatriotic? Hah! I just said it is too bad that she - and you, bill, can't see the good in the world. Everything is bad according to you.

Yeah, spousal abuse still occurs, but NOW it is not brushed over, it is prosecuted (well, in some counties it is, anyway)... failing public schools? Where? My kids got a phenomenal education all the way through, their high school education was better than some colleges. Why? Because we are very lucky here, and because they had phenomenal teachers and they knew what a gift they were being given (a free education - math teachers, science teachers, history teachers, art teachers, all specially trained and there just for them, pretty amazing stuff - imagine the alternatives, bill!) and they took full advantage of it.

Try this, bill - buy a journal... every day, write down at least one thing you are thankful for. You can write all the things that are bad in the world, too, it's your journal, but try and find at least one thing - like you know, you have unlimited freedom of speech, you can write comments on a blog. In some parts of the world, you wouldn't have that. Maybe it's just that you didn't get a flat tire today, doesn't have to be "world peace." Normally, you are supposed to write FIVE things, but that might be pretty tough...

Drink up!

 
At 7:48 PM, Anonymous Anonymous said...

We are leaving our children a looming catastrophe. Global warming, landfills overflowing with the junk Rose crows about, dwindling vital resources, ever decreasing job opportunities topped off with crushing multiple generational debt that is squandered on an immoral and illegal war for corporate profit. A world that has gone from admiring this country to fearing and despising it.

Us baby boomers have really made a mess of things. Denying the mess isn't going to fix it.

 
At 8:10 PM, Blogger The Boy Most Likely to ... said...

Please don't forget to Recycle!!!

-boy

 
At 8:10 PM, Blogger Fred said...

"landfills overflowing with the junk Rose crows about,...".

Interesting; I start a thread about garbage and recycling, and Bill (assuming this is Bill since he's taking some hits now and might want to go anon) and he says I'm pushing some right wing agenda.

What an ass.

And if 7:48 isn't Bill, 7:48 is an ass, too.

 
At 8:21 PM, Anonymous Anonymous said...

Fred, you shouldn't drink and blog.

 
At 8:34 PM, Anonymous Anonymous said...

No, not Bill. Sorry you can't refute anything I posted. You aren't a very challenging debator.

Fingersfly

 
At 9:53 PM, Anonymous Anonymous said...

Fred you are a chump.

 
At 10:06 PM, Blogger Carol said...

Oh Fred, I don't think you and I are very far apart from the so-hum residents. We currently are in the age of recycling. 50 years ago we would all have been hunting and gathering for our dinner because we would have been living off the land. Humboldt County is the last of the Old West, at least the mystique of the Old West.

 
At 10:15 PM, Anonymous Anonymous said...

Yeah, so lighten up on the hippies.

 
At 10:19 PM, Anonymous Raoul said...

What a boutique topic for a blog post! Omigawd what a talent. Fred. Call us.

 
At 10:50 PM, Anonymous Anonymous said...

The guy that called Fred a chump also calls people who oppose illegal immigration a chump. He is the only local blogger who ever calls other people "a chump."

For some reason, I always think of him as a "chimp."

Hey, guess what? Name-calling is fun. I think I'll do it more often!

 
At 11:06 PM, Anonymous Anonymous said...

Chimp... Thats a good one...

 
At 1:38 PM, Anonymous Anonymous said...

Carol, you saying that 50 years ago, thats 1967, you were hunter gathering and living off the land??? More likely you were living in VW van and sponging off good ole' mom and dad. Or living at home under stict Catholic discipline, longing to do the down and dirty with Tom Jones. Eating lots of supermarket meat and potatoes.

 
At 6:43 PM, Anonymous Anonymous said...

1967 was forty (40) years ago, dangit! These young whipper-snappers can't get anything right.

 
At 7:55 PM, Blogger Rose said...

1957, Carol. Ben Franklin was still on the (silver) half dollars. Fifty years ago, your parents were not cavemen, Carol. They probably had one car, not two or more. They probably did not have a TV, and if they did it was black and white. They may have had a phone, most likely a party line. Girls were allowed to wear pants to schoool on fridays, the "hippie" generation had not yet materialized. They had just finished up a World War, and may or may not have served, may have been drafted. Long hair hadn't yet become fashionable for men,

You're right in the sense that if your parents hunted, they did so to feed the family. They may have had a garden and grew their own food...

TV shows showed married couples sleeping in separate beds and unmarried couples didn't sleep together at all. :)

And who says we're not leaving a better world to our kids.

 
At 5:45 AM, Blogger Carol said...

OMG LOL, you ALL have me wrong! I wasn't even born 50 years ago. Go over to 299 Opine and you will see what I am talking about. In Humboldt County people some folks were living off the land, as the both the Ernie's have talked about.

 
At 5:48 AM, Blogger Carol said...

OK, maybe they had jobs in the woods or for the forestry, but they still hunted and gathered food to supplement eeking out a living. At least that is how I read their stories.

 
At 6:01 AM, Blogger Carol said...

Read about hunting here on 299 Opine and you will see what it was like in th ol' days in Humboldt County.

 
At 9:25 AM, Anonymous Anonymous said...

I can tell you, I hunt and ride down there alot. There is about a billion miles of plastic irrigation tubes left all through the open space...it will never rot. There are scores of abandoned illegally built hovels that the growers lived in temporarily. There is a shit load of dumped diesel fuel and other toxic crap.

 
At 9:34 AM, Blogger Carol said...

We have been having similar problems down river by the mouth of the Eel at Crab Park and Pedrazini Park. Last year there was a truck load of insulation dumped by the side of the road. No way as a volunteer would I touch that stuff. When my 4H group and I were picking up litter along the RR tracks in Loleta last year, we cam across beer bottles full of stinky urine. Disgusting! I have not gathered the children for litter hauling since then, but do pick up trash around our home. Illegal dumping is just gross!

 
At 9:57 AM, Anonymous Anonymous said...

Yes - but we in Humboldt are known for it.

You ever gone to one of the tree sitter sites after they left.

I have...as I said, I hunt and ride a lot.

It is gross and disgusting.

Hyporcrites if you ask me.

 
At 2:06 PM, Blogger ΛΕΟΝΙΔΑΣ said...

What 9:25AM says is also true of Weitchpec and Pecwan.

 
At 3:43 PM, Anonymous Anonymous said...

Rose, you are so wrong.
In 1957, long hair on men was very cool, but only, of course, if it was slathered in Brylcreem and combed carefully into place.

 
At 3:45 PM, Anonymous Anonymous said...

Why does his type of blog instantly hide a comment if you accidentally click on it, then dump you back at the top of the comments section?
Boy, that's annoying.

 
At 4:05 PM, Blogger Rose said...

LOl - well, I was only a baby, so I don't know what the hairstyles were. Later on I remember the hairstyle was beehives "teased" with rat-tail combs, luckily that was just enough before my time that I got to bypass it. The relaxed style of the "hippies" was a welcome relief, freedom from dress codes and uniforms. We were born into the greatest time of all.

 
At 4:39 PM, Blogger ΛΕΟΝΙΔΑΣ said...

Commercial on the radio program "Sam Spade" 1949:
"You better get Wildroot Cream oil Charlie
It Keeps your hair in trim
You see it's Non Alcoholic Charlie
It's made with soothing Lanolin"

The hair referred to did not extend below the collar.

An old fart who remembers

 
At 5:09 PM, Blogger Fred said...

3:43 wrote, "Rose, you are so wrong.
In 1957, long hair on men was very cool, but only, of course, if it was slathered in Brylcreem and combed carefully into place.".

Maybe I'm wrong here, as I was born in '55, but seems to me hair was pretty short back then, by today's standards.

 
At 8:31 PM, Anonymous Anonymous said...

OK, Fred, the Beatles got the credit for mainstreaming long hair on men. But I'm telling you, the kids who were on the ragged edge of junior high school suspension often wore their greasy locks long. The Brylcreem (if indeed that is what they were using) plastered their hair down, thus disguising its length from the conformists of the 50's who were mentally conditioned to see short hair on males even where long, greasy hair actually existed.

People back then also believed their President always told the truth, if that helps you understand just how different we are today from what they were then.

 
At 7:11 AM, Blogger Carol said...

I thought this post was about garbage in Sohum.

 
At 8:39 PM, Anonymous Anonymous said...

and there is lots of trash too !

 

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